Well at least it would seem I can count on Mike and 2nr to see where I'm comeing from.
Mike been there and done that myself thats why I'm of the opinion that they are cowards.
2nr exactly! A kid pointing a gun at our troops is begging to be killed, so give him what he wants.




Semper Fi SAINT. May you rest in peace.

exactly, like i was trying to say...i bet 95% of those civilians that were killed, were killed because they shot at U.S. troops, which in my opinoion makes them enemy soldiers, not civilians


You'll never touch God's hand
You'll never taste God's breath
Because you'll never see the second coming
Life's too short to be focused on insanity
I've seen the ways of God
I'll take the devil any day
Hail Satan

(slayer, skeleton christ, 2006)

Think we tie a rope around this guys dick and tie the other end to a tree and push him off the tree.




- 2004 Cavalier - 124k, owned since new

^ ^ ^ ^ ^ give a sex change and make him were a berka (sp?)




Semper Fi SAINT. May you rest in peace.

Neither death nor prison...

This douche was laughing at 9-11 tapes and showing nothing but hatred for Americans... tie him up colonial style or shackle him to a tree and put him in NY and allow everyone to give him a cheap shot... beat the crap outta him until he is near death than let him recover... then put him out there again do this over and over until the evil bastard dies

SPITfire wrote:Neither death nor prison...

This douche was laughing at 9-11 tapes and showing nothing but hatred for Americans... tie him up colonial style or shackle him to a tree and put him in NY and allow everyone to give him a cheap shot... beat the crap outta him until he is near death than let him recover... then put him out there again do this over and over until the evil bastard dies

Well, then put me in the same boat--because what I've seen of the nazi states of amerikka the past 5 years less than @!#$ impresses me--=and I'm more then willing to dance on the graves of nazi amerikka the same way I @!#$ on the graves of stalinist russia or fascist germany.

What you 'meri-punks do inside your own borders is your business, its your right.

however, if you think you are going to walk over the entire planet enforcing your bull@!#$ at the point of the gun--then the right to resist comes into play.

So--right now as I see it--dickwad buskie threating Iran with nuclear strikes if they do not obey the dictates of the @!#$ madman--give Iran the perfect right to launch a pre-emptive strike to protect themselves from amerikkan imperialism.

Personally---I hope they do it. You yankee @!#$s NEED a good solid kick in the nuts to teach you you are not in charge.




Rice.....Part of a balanced Pontiac diet.

so you hope that Iran murders innocent americans, because of the actions of the government that about half of the country didn't want. @!#$, your just as bad as any terrorist

i hope you die a horrible death, and soon


You'll never touch God's hand
You'll never taste God's breath
Because you'll never see the second coming
Life's too short to be focused on insanity
I've seen the ways of God
I'll take the devil any day
Hail Satan

(slayer, skeleton christ, 2006)

So???--the US is murdering innocent iraqi civilans--then wanna cry "foul" when somebody else does it back atchya?????

World dont work that way. War dont work that way.

Look into pandoras box.




Rice.....Part of a balanced Pontiac diet.

no, we killed "civilians" who were attacking U.S. troops for no reason. this war has had very few honest civilian casualtys.

hell when i was there we had a carbomber try to run the gate I was manning, i shot him, and it was probably racked up as a "civilian" casualty, even though he was, in my opinion, an enemy combatant, as he was trying to kill me

if iran launched a nuclear strike on the U.S. all they would do is kill a whole lot of non combatants, making them murderers and terrorists


You'll never touch God's hand
You'll never taste God's breath
Because you'll never see the second coming
Life's too short to be focused on insanity
I've seen the ways of God
I'll take the devil any day
Hail Satan

(slayer, skeleton christ, 2006)

Do bombing runs count Mike?

You gotta know that the PGM/LGB's that are attached to the mk82 dumb-bombs only hit their intended target 60-70% of the time, right?



Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.

yeah i know were not perfect GAM, but at least we were attacking valid targets. if iran launched a strike on the us (which i don't think they can) they would be killing civilians just for the sake of killing civilians.

all im trying to say is that the media doesn't differentiate a civilian combatant from a non combatant, they just label them all as civilians, which is too broad of a term when dealing with this type of combat


You'll never touch God's hand
You'll never taste God's breath
Because you'll never see the second coming
Life's too short to be focused on insanity
I've seen the ways of God
I'll take the devil any day
Hail Satan

(slayer, skeleton christ, 2006)

I never said you were Mike...

Also given that there were runs on mixed targets (ie military civillian power sub-stations, and water treatment areas)I can see how it can get mixed up. I'm not so naive as to say that there are always clearly defined military and civillians (hell, you have to know that there are fedayeen hussein that are basically fighting as guerillas), but, assuming that anyone that is resisting (ie, not shooting) is trying to do harm on soldiers is myopic... I've got serious problems when people get killed because of a minor f-up in the designation of targets though..

Case in Point.




Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.

WHOOPS!!!

Disregard that link....

http://canadaonline.about.com/library/weekly/aa041802a.htm
^^^ The story I was trying to refer to... My bad.

(If a mod sees this, and could kindly fix the link, I'd really appreciate it!)



Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.

yeah i totaly agree with you that any unneccissary killing is stupid. and the military does do a pretty good job at minimizng non combatant casualtys. were not perfect, but were pretty good at it. its just hard when you have to tell the enemy from the guy buying a loaf of bread, and both of em look identical


You'll never touch God's hand
You'll never taste God's breath
Because you'll never see the second coming
Life's too short to be focused on insanity
I've seen the ways of God
I'll take the devil any day
Hail Satan

(slayer, skeleton christ, 2006)

Long gone are the days of uniformed warfare... The same kind of thing happened during the War for Independance

The measure will be when liberation becomes tyrrany.

I'm really looking forward to what the next President will do about Iraq... It's pretty obvious that Bush didn't have a well thought out plan for this.



Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.

no he sure didn't. I think he thought it would be fast, and over in a hurry, i don't think he anticipated this long of a fight.

the problem is that now, we can't just pull out of iraq and leave it. we destroyed their government totally, and the new government isn't self sufficient yet. so basically we have to stay there to get them back on their feet

im also curious how the next president will handle it


You'll never touch God's hand
You'll never taste God's breath
Because you'll never see the second coming
Life's too short to be focused on insanity
I've seen the ways of God
I'll take the devil any day
Hail Satan

(slayer, skeleton christ, 2006)

Quote:

Well, then put me in the same boat--because what I've seen of the nazi states of amerikka the past 5 years less than @!#$ impresses me--=and I'm more then willing to dance on the graves of nazi amerikka the same way I @!#$ on the graves of stalinist russia or fascist germany.

thats real nice... judging by the fact that 60% of this country support Bush you want to see Americans die for no reason... what are you thinking? Where are u from? Do you know what this Moussaoui guy represents?

Quote:

So--right now as I see it--dickwad buskie threating Iran with nuclear strikes if they do not obey the dictates of the @!#$ madman--give Iran the perfect right to launch a pre-emptive strike to protect themselves from amerikkan imperialism.

so you support a tyrannic Islamic fundamentalist government that is threatening the security of the region? Thats great, and don't you realize we would wipe that nation off the map if they treid #$%& on us. Don't get me wrong, I don't want stupid Bush to attack Iran by any means but I also think we have to defend ourselves. I am not a Bush supporter at all but I am a American.

You are being a hypocrit saying that America deserves to be attacked and innocent civilians killed... and calling us "Nazis" . Your thinking reminds me of the killing of the Jews by these same Nazis... if you could care less about Americans dying, why care about Iraqis dying?

Why do you care about a few Iraqi civilians dying? This is war for Gods sake, there are no perfect weapons... we fire-bombed Germany and Japan and the people at home did not give a crap. These people were also non-combatants, many who did not agree with the leadership. Yet war is hell like that. Why are people like you all bitchy about Iraqis dying, they are killing us too!

I meant 60% DON'T support Bush

I actually dont give a rats ass about the Iraqis dying, and no I DONT "support" the islamic fundies. I think they are nutbars.

What I DO support, absoloutley, is the concept of thier ownership of thier contry and thier right to do exactly the @!#$ as they damn well please in it, and the fact that the rest of the world dont get a say in the matter. Its quite bluntly NONE OF THE WESTS DAMN BUSINESS.

I dont particularlly like the cristian fundies in town either--in fact if I saw thier meeting house burning I'd laugh as I drove by.

HOWEVER--if any thug tried to walk into thier place and tell them how to live in THIER own temple (or whatever the hell they call it) I'd be one of the 1st to grab whatever was handy and defend thier right to be a bunch of anal-retentive loosers. If that means beating out the brains of some "authority", so be it.--Its not something I apply just to the Iran/Iraq situation, its my general outlook.

Simple truth is the greatest threat to personal freedom in north amerikka is government/law/alphabet-soup "enforcement" thugs. Wether they are "in action" here or abroad makes little difference, they are still scum.

As for your argument about the "innocents"--togh. That argument and that "defense" has been going on ever since ww1 troops put artilery pieces in schoolyards and whined you can't morter us because of the children in the school. Same argument. "You cant kill innocent ammericans becuse of the neo-cons hiding among us"......the answer is simple--kick the noe's out in the open and the "innocents" wont be in harms way. Otherwise, my hatred for the fascist govern-MENTAL thugs and thier "authority" is deep enough that there is no price too high to be rid of them.

What I'm saying is the US has a very bad internal problem with the nazis (the only word to really describe them).....and its time to drive the US back inside thier own borders and let them sort out thier own mess, otherwise about 4 billion of the 6 billion on the planet are getting more and more ready to sort it out for them.








Rice.....Part of a balanced Pontiac diet.

Isn't freedom oh speach great? It allows sunbird to spout off his crap and get everyone worked into a frenzy because of his stupid statements. Problem is the freedom he so loves doesn't exist in the countries hes defending with his lashing out against the US. In fact its the US and its horrible policies and its terrible military that he hates sooo much that aford him the rights to degrade it. Think I'm kidding sunbird? Do you honestly think for one second that if the US ever did fall to these Islamic nut cases that they would stop at the Canadian border? "But we're not in it" is that what you'd say?
Well neither is France and look at the wonderful time there haveing over there. If you and all of Canada don't realize the only reason why you have the wonderful rights you enjoy so much is because no one could come thru us first and then get to you, you are compleatly delusional! If we fall YOUR next dumb ass! Do you honestly think Canada in all its military might could stop these guys? Hell we're haveing a tough go of it, and we're the last super power in the world!! What would you do? Huh? Throw a hockey puck at them? You'd go down faster then a white house intern with new knee pads to break in! Go ahead make fun alllll you want to, talk alllll the smack you want about us. But don't forget the reason your even able to bash us is because of the U.S. in the first place!

We go and your next there bright boy! So perhapps since you hate us soooo much and you hope we get our yankee asses handed to us ( that made me laugh! what are you 2? ) that you should brush up on your Islam cause we go theres no one to defend you.

BTW, why don't you worry about your own back yard first sunbird the U.S. may not be perfect but we're further along then Canada is.



Semper Fi SAINT. May you rest in peace.

Jack... While I can appreciate what yoiu are saying, the last time Canada had to fight for it's freedom we did it without your help (for the first 5 years), we had the most feared infantry in the European theatre, and the world's largest navy. Please do not defame our fallen soldiers. There's one thing that people seem to forget about Canada, when called to a just cause, every able bodied person will spring to action. In WWII almost 75% of the male population signed up and a large proportion of women went as well. Everyone gave up their aluminum to make aircraft etc and the entire country went into war mode. If we are properly motivated this country will stand up and fight. In WWI anyone that was able and didn't sign up was ridiculed very harshly and sometimes lynched. This is no laughing matter to us.

More recently yes, the US has been a "protector" of sorts. Remember though, that's what the US wanted. Everytime we develope a great weapon or platform the US either takes it (through peacefull negotiation) or kills it (through threats and economic measures). We cooperate in many actions and they are almost always labelled a US action. You know who's in charge in Afganastan right now?

PAX

I aint saying kaNUTa isnt in need of a good @!#$kicking either, but thats not what this thread is about. I most certainly have no love whatsoever for our govern-mental types either and would be more than happy to toss a drowning one an anchor.

Or that the raggies may or may not be a threat. Its a matter of priorities. They are 1/2 a planet away without the means to show up on my doorstep--hence a low priority. The "home-grown alphabet soup thugs" are right next door, and HAVE the means to show up on my doorstep. Hence a much greater threat and where my current hatred is directed.

The 1st biggest, and closest, "threat" right now to everybody's personal liberty is amerikka and the way it has developed over the past 20 years. 75% of the @!#$ in kaNUTa is a DIRECT result of our brain-dead politico's copying US laws and policies. What exists right now is agin to hitler and mussalini. Bush is hitler, and harper is a benito-wanna-be.

You are right you are "ahead" of canada--by about 5 years down the road to a jack-booted police state. Mind you, I have no doubt whatsoever that the sub-human things called lawyers and politico's up here are busy copying monkey-boys "thug manifesto" as we type and there is no shortage of psycopaths lining up to be issued thier jack-boots, black uniforms and "fritz" helets. Its a foregone conclusion.

As for having its ass handed to it, when do you want to start? Vietnam? Somalia? Serbia?Afhanastan? Iraq?. The US leadership have proven themselves to be @!#$ geniouses at walking into a guerilla war situation, getting a BIG pile of troops knocked off with a 10-fold increased count in "collateral damage", then screaming "what the @!#$ do we do now ?"

Just as the brits were too @!#$ stupid to understand in 1796, the US is too @!#$ stupid to understand now that there IS NO WAY to win a war where anything more than about 15% of the indiginous population is against your occupation, especially when as somebody said erlier, they dont bother with little things like uniforms or lines.

And dont worry about needing to "defend" us. We have already been taken over by the @!#$ liberals and thier "multi-culturalism", except apart from a few big cities like toronto, vancover, montreal ect and the delusional minds of the social-engineering scum, it dont fly. Walk into just about any small town in the country and you will find the big cities and thier "laws"/"policies" on the matter are pretty much an ignored source of ammusement--then pull out your rand-mcnally and find out just how much of the territory that encompases.




Rice.....Part of a balanced Pontiac diet.

HAHA Wasn't defameing or belittleing at all, you should know better of me then that. I know what Canada's military history is like but thats just it, history. I hate to say it but right now a well armed little league team could take you over .

Sunbird, you seem angry, are you alright? Getting enough sleep lately? Try some fiber in your diet that make help. The reason those little BS wars never went well was because of political presure not to allow the military full raign to do what ever they need to get the job done. Example #1 Vietnam, while in charge of ordnance on the U.S.S. HANCOCK ( an aircraft carrier ) my father loaded 2 a piece nuclear bombs onto 4 F8U Crusaders and they were on the flight deck awaiting final go when the stand down order came from the white house. Seems LBJ would rather he and Lady Bird keep rakin in millions by selling arms to the US then end the war. Example #2 Somalia, Clinton caved to the UN and pulled our guys out proveing himself spineless. Example #3
Serbia, Um I hate to break the news to you but Slobo is no longer in charge there. So bad example on your part. Example #4 Afganistan, Al Queerda is no longer running the country like it used to and is forced to live in caves. Hmmm another example shot down.
Example #5 Iraq, Another bubble burster for you sunbird but Saddam is no longer in charge there but a govt that has been electid by the Iraqie people. Yet another example shot down. Your not doing so good there Sunbird. But I see you like numbers so we'll talk numbers for a minute. Last year in Washington DC there were more murders then US troops killed in action in Iraq. Does that mean DC should be abandoned as well?
How about the fact that there is less violence in Iraq then in LA on almost any given day.
Should we pull out of LA? Or lets look at the whole state of California its in debt more then most small countries! Is that reason enough to kick them out of the Union? The fact is things in Iraq are going quite well in comparison to even law enforcement in this country and law enforement in Canada as well. Did you know that you guys higher crime rate then we do? Yup its true! Higher rape and much much higher % of burglery and break ins. Like I said make sure your own back yard is nice and clean before you start complaining about ours.

Any other examples you have that I can shoot down for you? If so I'm ready for them




Semper Fi SAINT. May you rest in peace.

You tell it Jack! Just as it should be told.


____________________________________________________________________

Madjack wrote:Like I said before, building an engine like ours (2.2 or 2200) is a painstaking chore , since there is so few custom made parts. It's frustrating to me too, but that's what I like about doing this engine, it's the challenge.

Sunbird, If you are going to rant, get your facts straight.. Let's start with 1776 (not 1796), and in fact it should be more like 1767 or so, when the fire was lit, not when it was done burning.

Jack, I didn't mean to imply that you had defamed our fallen, but that you were getting close. If you are talking about defending Canada's interests, the last time we did that was WWII, unless Korea was "in our best interest".. I would despute that. At any rate, the last time we actually needed to go and fight, we did it well, and en-mass.

Now, let's try to be fair to our current military, after all, we did win Top Gun again last year

Yes, it is small, but it is well trained and I doubt that aside from the major powers in the world (US, China, UK, Russia) anyone could successfully take us over. Who could? Italy? Belgium? Attacked by the massive Sweedish military? My point being that we look small (militarily) because you guys are so absolutely huge. For a country of our population, we have a well trained, well armed (mostly) and appropriately sized armed force. We do need to expand our militay though because we do want to maintain our relationship with the US.

I just wish the US would stop dragging us into resource wars. Let's face it, that's the only wars being fought right now.

PAX